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Old 01-16-2014, 06:37 PM   #1
Woodspirit
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Cougar Watch

Protect the Adirondacks has started a new Cougar Watch project to record public sightings of cougars (Puma concolor) in and around the Adirondack Park.

http://www.protectadks.org/2014/01/p...watch-project/
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Old 01-16-2014, 08:27 PM   #2
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Nice!
'Bout time.
Kudos to Protect for taking the initiative.
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Old 01-20-2014, 10:53 AM   #3
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I sure hope that they have a good system in place to differentiate the "credible" reports from those that aren't legitimate- otherwise, I'm sure they'll have quite a bit of work cut out for them in following up on the reports.
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Old 01-23-2014, 08:48 AM   #4
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This sent to me from a good friend that lives in Vail, Co. This animal was taken in Redcliff by his neighbor. Imagine seeing that in the woods, would it not transcend you to another level of awareness?
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Old 01-23-2014, 11:03 AM   #5
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What is the animal called that is 2/3s the size, same ears and tail but is very dark brown?
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Old 01-23-2014, 10:49 PM   #6
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Holy smokes! That thing is huge. Any idea what it weighed? I wouldn't want to see that thing stalking me. The size of the tail alone is pretty amazing.
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Old 01-24-2014, 09:01 AM   #7
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Holy smokes! That thing is huge. Any idea what it weighed? I wouldn't want to see that thing stalking me. The size of the tail alone is pretty amazing.
The guy holding it is 6'2" tall for perspective. Don't know the weight but will find out. My friend also sent images of a big cat patrolling the neighborhood where he lives which is near Edwards, Co.
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Old 01-24-2014, 09:14 AM   #8
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Beautiful animal. That must have been an awesome hunt.
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Old 01-24-2014, 05:40 PM   #9
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pretty healthy looking cat. Well fed to.
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Old 01-25-2014, 09:18 AM   #10
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If the only reason people want Cougars in the Adirondacks is so they can shoot them, then for the sake of the Cougars, I hope they never find any.
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Old 01-25-2014, 01:58 PM   #11
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If anyone thinks the deer herd is a minimum now, bring on the cats it will end all. Same thing the wolves did to Yellowstone Moose population.
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Old 01-25-2014, 02:26 PM   #12
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If the only reason people want Cougars in the Adirondacks is so they can shoot them, then for the sake of the Cougars, I hope they never find any.
I agree. I don't see the point in killing the cats.

Sounds pretty hippy dippy but why not shoot them with a camera?

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If anyone thinks the deer herd is a minimum now, bring on the cats it will end all. Same thing the wolves did to Yellowstone Moose population.
I don't know anything about the moose in Yellowstone but I'd imagine bringing the wolves back is restoring things to the way they used to be before they were eradicated.

Nature has a simple way of dealing with predators or the food chain in general. If the prey become scarce, then the predators become even more so. Why do people think that re-introducing a species that was wiped out will somehow change this? Nature will balance the population. Wolves will not just keep magically growing in population and driving the herbivores into extinction. It just doesn't work that way.

It only gets screwed up when we kill the predators.
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Old 01-25-2014, 06:13 PM   #13
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If anyone thinks the deer herd is a minimum now, bring on the cats it will end all. Same thing the wolves did to Yellowstone Moose population.
What's your source for that? From everything I've read the wolves actually helped the ecology as well as the prey. By keeping the balance that is intended.

I read this real radical thing once and what it said was that the herds needed to be culled and balanced based on maintaining the health of the herds, not their availibilty for sport.
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Old 01-28-2014, 09:05 PM   #14
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I'm not going to weigh in on the cougar debate, but it is fair to say that the wolves that started in Yellowstone have spread to many states and all but wiped out herds of elk and deer in a number of areas. Yes, they do weed out the infirm & elderly but much more as well IMHO. Of course one's opinion on this probably hinges on whether you put more stock in publications that support hunting versus "ecology." They both have their agendas.
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Old 01-29-2014, 11:08 AM   #15
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EagleCrag--Do you have references/statistics to back up your statements?
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Old 01-29-2014, 11:35 AM   #16
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Wolves have hammered the elk and deer populations in Idaho, Wyoming, and Montana. It's not limited to Yellowstone...


"A Yellowstone-sponsored report from the mid-1990s stated "Fifteen North American wolf experts predicted that 100 wolves in Yellowstone would reduce the elk by less than 20 percent, 10 years after reintroduction." In reality, that number turned out to be 44 percent. If you look back at the elk count of 1994, the year before the start of the wolf reintroduction program, the size of the elk herd is now down by 80 percent."

Year Elk Population
2012 3,915
2011 4,174
2010 4,635
2009 6,070
2008 6,279
2007 6,738
2006 6,588
2005 9,545
2004 8,335
2003-02 9,215
2001 11,969
2000 13, 400 (prior to late season elk hunt)
1999 14,538 (prior to late season elk hunt)
1998 11,742
1997 no count taken
1996 no count taken
1995 16,791 (when wolf reintroduction began)
1994 19,045 (year before wolf reintroduction)

http://rmefblog.blogspot.com/2013/03...ion-falls.html

http://www.oregonlive.com/pacific-no...experienc.html

http://www.ktvb.com/news/Wolves-fire...232153351.html

http://magicvalley.com/news/local/hu...527c4e99f.html

http://www.kpax.com/news/biologists-...unt-changes/#_

http://www.krem.com/news/local/Hunte...174853941.html
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Old 01-29-2014, 02:31 PM   #17
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As most know, there are many difficult issues pertaining to wolves and how their existence near humans can stir the pot. Mountain Lions, however, have a much more secretive life and do not make themselves known if they can help it. If a once native apex predator is desired to restore the aspect of fear into the herbivores of the Adirondack Park then the cougar is the right species to move forward with. They will be easy to study and manage and overtime they may even ease some fears humans have of big predators of the like. Thus, maybe making it possible to open the door for eastern wolves to enter from the North.
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Old 01-29-2014, 04:03 PM   #18
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Those are impressive numbers, Limekiln. In my circles of communication, there is a general consensus there were too many elk in Yellowstone. Elk are certainly not endangered. Sometimes it seems as if some hunters regard large ungulates such as deer, elk and bighorns as free-ranging livestock, carefully protected from non-human predation until it's time to "harvest" them. I want balanced wild ecosystems with a full complement of prey and predators, with human hunters being only one predator.
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Old 01-29-2014, 04:09 PM   #19
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Also, I will say this is not my area of expertise, BUT 18 years is a VERY short time. Even if the population of the Elk is low there is some time constant for the system to recover and start degrading the wolf population, during which time the Elk with start to increase in numbers.

The ebb and flow the population may take a while to stabilize, and even if it does, that does not mean it won't ebb and flow in the future due to food stock and climate.

The point still remains. The wolf (or predator) population will be regulated by the Elk (prey) population if we don't meddle with it. It has for millions of years before we did, I'm sure it will again. If for some reason Elk go extinct, I wouldn't be pointing my finger at the wolves as the cause.
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Old 01-29-2014, 05:12 PM   #20
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Those are impressive numbers, Limekiln. In my circles of communication, there is a general consensus there were too many elk in Yellowstone.
You are correct in that there were too many elk in the park prior to the wolf introduction. But there's a happy medium somewhere between 4,000 and 19,000.

My point is simply that the introduction of big predators like wolves or mountain lions to the ADK's will have a big effect on deer numbers.
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