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Old 10-12-2020, 08:45 PM   #41
Wldrns
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You do realize that AFRs have no real enforcement powers in the field, right? They can advise and attempt to educate, but cannot force a violator to do anything or change their activity. They can only monitor and then report back to their regional ranger. I've known some great ones who have served for years. One ranger friend encouraged me to apply when I retired, but I had other buckets to kick. That said, I am sure it is a wonderful job for the right young person pursuing skills in that potential career track.

For many years (actually since 1979), the BSA has run a program that began with early origins of LNT in the Adirondacks by a few forward looking caring BSA leaders and DEC rangers, during a period when BSA members were being blamed, both rightfully and wrongfully, for many wrong or destructive kinds of activity in the wilderness. It in many ways continues with DEC acknowledgement and support. BSA National Camping School trains wilderness trek leader guides (typically college age folks) in an annual 8 day program, with field training and strict evaluation and certification of specific skills in preparation for working out of resident summer BSA camps. If hired they will be an official guide for scouts and their adult leaders on 5 day wilderness treks. The Adirondack developed syllabus version of this program became the adopted published national model for similar BSA training in other wilderness regions across the country, suitably modified to the region. Many of the graduates of this program will go on to apply for and easily pass state outdoor guide licensing exams and have themselves become instructors in organizations such as NOLS and other national outdoor leadership programs.
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Old 10-12-2020, 08:49 PM   #42
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Yes I know stewards and afrs cannot enforce. They can however detain or acquire info that can be relayed to an eco. Read my previous post.

That would be my suggestion on how to handle that


I’d also try to target teachers for summer work. They retain benefits so a summer gig is actually really low cost to hire them.
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Old 10-12-2020, 09:02 PM   #43
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We would love to get teachers trained as BSA summer trek leader guides. The problem is, at least in NY, school does not get out until late June, which is too late to attend NCS and reliably train and hire guide candidates for summer work. School superintendents do not look kindly on teachers who ask to take off during exam week, when NCS is held.

So how does an AFR physically detain a violator who does not want to be detained, or do other than to report to their regional ranger as I stated as read in my previous post?
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Old 10-12-2020, 09:12 PM   #44
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Smartphone really makes it easy to capture a picture of someone and relay it to the ECO.

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Old 10-12-2020, 10:11 PM   #45
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They could use reading this thread as punishment , might be considered cruel and unusual though .
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Old 10-13-2020, 12:38 AM   #46
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Old 10-13-2020, 06:39 AM   #47
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They could use reading this thread as punishment , might be considered cruel and unusual though .
Lol
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Old 10-13-2020, 08:25 AM   #48
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We would love to get teachers trained as BSA summer trek leader guides. The problem is, at least in NY, school does not get out until late June, which is too late to attend NCS and reliably train and hire guide candidates for summer work. School superintendents do not look kindly on teachers who ask to take off during exam week, when NCS is held.
That's unfortunate, but if they were serious about recruiting they could change the date to a time of school vacation. I assume once you are trained, you'll be eligible each year?
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Old 10-13-2020, 08:56 AM   #49
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That's unfortunate, but if they were serious about recruiting they could change the date to a time of school vacation. I assume once you are trained, you'll be eligible each year?
Massive Thread Drift, but since you asked.....
BSA National Camping School training dates are determined by BSA National per region. The Northeast Regional NCS in New York is always the very last one of the season, set to train all manner of skill section directors (including shooting sports, Ecology, climbing, waterfront, program, trek leader, etc.) before summer camp season begins. It would be hard to train an Adirondack guide unless you can do the training in the Adirondacks. The week after NCS the trained program directors need to spend a week at their assigned resident camp to help open and to prepare it before scouts arrive, usually the first week of July (after public school ends in NY). Training certification needs to be renewed every 5 years, (unless you are on permanent instructor staff).
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Old 10-13-2020, 09:42 AM   #50
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I'm more interested in what it would take for teachers to team up with the DEC and become gainfully employed over summer break as Stewards or AFRs.

Obviously people who work in education (and love the outdoors) would be ideal candidates for summer help. Seems like some simple certs in LNT and DEC policy would all that would be needed. Perhaps some special training in how to deal with difficult individuals.
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Old 10-13-2020, 10:02 AM   #51
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Perhaps some special training in how to deal with difficult individuals.
oh... the stories I could tell about socially dealing with incompetent and disruptive homesick scouter "Bobby" and with mean non-LNT believing and biased scoutmaster "Mr. Finkelstein" when they appear during instructor constructed role playing training scenarios both in pre trek classroom and later out on the trail. We have DEC employees on staff, and a ranger led policy talk and Q&A session. There is a reason why our training program is 8 days long. I have been told by guides at the end of the season that they have experienced both cases in reality.
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