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Old 12-17-2015, 08:10 PM   #21
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Actually, the rumor that I've heard (and it only a rumor) is that Mr. Ma intends to subdivide out a smaller parcel for his estate, and give the bulk of the land to the state to be "forever wild."
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Old 12-17-2015, 08:50 PM   #22
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OK, that's fine. You are certainly free to develop an expectation of how someone else wants to spend their money. But it's the taxpayers' money, and it's their decision how to spend it. Funny how the organizations that are so rabid to buy this kind of land seldom belly up to the bar themselves, with their own money to buy it. It's all about marching with signs to spend someone else's money.
Were the taxpayers asked? Also, check before blaming "organizations", the Nature Conservancy spends a lot of money up there.

"The Adirondack Chapter of The Nature Conservancy has protected over 571,000 acres since 1971."

http://www.nature.org/ourinitiatives...guidelines.xml
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Old 12-17-2015, 08:54 PM   #23
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Actually, the rumor that I've heard (and it only a rumor) is that Mr. Ma intends to subdivide out a smaller parcel for his estate, and give the bulk of the land to the state to be "forever wild."
If he did I'd change my tune in a heartbeat. Small estates for full time residents have little impact on the wildness of the Adirondack IMO.

But also my expectations for this were high due to the way it was publicized and the fact (?) that he had donated a lot of land to the public in China.
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Old 12-17-2015, 09:34 PM   #24
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Also, check before blaming "organizations", the Nature Conservancy spends a lot of money up there.
"The Adirondack Chapter of The Nature Conservancy has protected over 571,000 acres since 1971."
Yes, that is why I carefully used "seldom" rather than "never" in my post. I'm aware of the work of the conservancy, and most of it is good. I understand how it works as a buyer that can react faster than the state when parcels come up for sale. It should be kept in mind, however, that most of the land the conservancy protects is eventually sold to the state, and it is again the taxpayers who are doing the "protecting."

(I'm glad to see this discussion on an even keel. When I posted to this thread, folks were busy demonizing people they know nothing about, and suggesting that government should step in and "not allow" real estate transactions between willing sellers and buyers.)
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Old 12-18-2015, 07:48 AM   #25
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Well he did say he was going to stop the logging

OK, buy the land, but I call bull hockey on the whole conservationist thing.

And if you think I'm full of it, just think for a minute if instead of a bunch of large tracts of accessible state land, you had a bunch of large tracts of private 'wilderness' instead. Any of you on here who say you'd support that are liars. You all want access just as much as the rest of us.
Yeah I am all for access but I'm more for protection.
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Old 12-21-2015, 04:48 PM   #26
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Anyone can buy their way onto a board.

Why does NYS allow sale of the Park?
The land that was sold was not State owned.
The Park is comprised of private and State owned properties.
Private owners are free to sell their holdings.
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Old 12-21-2015, 04:51 PM   #27
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I'll say again no one, foreign or national can buy land that is State owned.
Jim
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Old 12-21-2015, 09:21 PM   #28
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I'll say again no one, foreign or national can buy land that is State owned.
Jim
Well, as we learned from the NYCO deal, anything seems possible these days.
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Old 12-21-2015, 10:02 PM   #29
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I'll say again no one, foreign or national can buy land that is State owned.
Jim
hard scrabble,
I can't say one way or another if what you're saying is true but I do know the state can lease state land for 99 years at a very inexpensive cost per acre. if the land contains infrastructure and building then they become part of the lease lock, stock and barrel - 99 years is forever for all of us here.
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Old 12-22-2015, 09:14 AM   #30
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I'll say again no one, foreign or national can buy land that is State owned.
Jim
I beg to differ : http://www.ogs.ny.gov/BU/RE/LM/ssrp.asp
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Old 12-22-2015, 11:15 AM   #31
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. . . . . and as we all know they can take your land even if you don't want to sell (eminent domain).
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Old 12-22-2015, 12:37 PM   #32
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The Nature Conservancy is an international organization - not an Adirondack organization. They just happen to have a chapter here.

Their board of directors is full of people from other countries. Jack Ma is just one of many.

He is widely known as a staunch environmental and social advocate in China.

Through his work and association with the Nature Conservancy, and obviously thanks to its Adirondack chapter, he became interested in the Adirondack Park and its model of conservation.

He purchased private land in the Park and plans on conserving it.

Those are some facts.

Here is some commentary.

I've heard all sorts of gripes from people since moving to the Adirondacks. But the one that seems to get the most yell time these days is that people think the state owns and buys too much land and that it would be better off kept in private ownership.

Here we have exactly that happening. A private individual is buying up a chunk of private land. One would think that would make people happy. But noooooo.... (thanks Belushi) they are not happy. Why? Because he is foreign? Rich? Because he will not do what they want him to do with it?

The fact that he is rich can't be the problem. Since people seem ok with large, very rich corporations owning land here (mining, logging, paper, et al)

The problem appears to be with the fact that he is from another country and with what he plans on doing, or not doing, with the land.

So I guess what people are really saying when they say that they want land in private ownership is that they want local (or at least American) ownership so it can be developed.

Last edited by Holdstrong; 12-22-2015 at 12:53 PM..
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Old 12-22-2015, 03:16 PM   #33
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But the one that seems to get the most yell time these days is that people think the state owns and buys too much land and that it would be better off kept in private ownership.
Interesting discussion, and I agree with some of it. But I think it's mostly off topic for this thread. The most "yelling" on this thread seems to be about wanting the state to keep all the land...
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Old 12-22-2015, 04:16 PM   #34
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Well, as we learned from the NYCO deal, anything seems possible these days.
Justin,
Please refresh my memory of the NYCO deal.
Jim
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Old 12-22-2015, 04:21 PM   #35
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hard scrabble,
I can't say one way or another if what you're saying is true but I do know the state can lease state land for 99 years at a very inexpensive cost per acre. if the land contains infrastructure and building then they become part of the lease lock, stock and barrel - 99 years is forever for all of us here.
I have no knowledge of the State leasing or selling land in the Forest Preserve.
The old "Permit Camps" were leased with an arrangement from the State, but they were terminated years ago.
Jim
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Old 12-22-2015, 04:22 PM   #36
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. . . . . and as we all know they can take your land even if you don't want to sell (eminent domain).
That's true everywhere in the US.
Jim
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Old 12-22-2015, 05:07 PM   #37
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Justin,
Please refresh my memory of the NYCO deal.
Jim
Did you vote in the NY General Election in 2013? It was on the ballot as a NY Constitutional Amendment to make a public land swap with a private corporation. And it passed.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/08/03/ny...osal.html?_r=0

https://ballotpedia.org/New_York_Lan...oposal_5_(2013)

http://www.northcountrypublicradio.o...ack-wilderness

http://www.adirondackalmanack.com/20...-bad-idea.html

http://www.adirondackalmanack.com/20...ilderness.html
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Old 12-22-2015, 05:21 PM   #38
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Did you vote in the NY General Election in 2013? It was on the ballot as a NY Constitutional Amendment to make a public land swap with a private corporation. And it passed.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/08/03/ny...osal.html?_r=0

https://ballotpedia.org/New_York_Lan...oposal_5_(2013)

http://www.northcountrypublicradio.o...ack-wilderness

http://www.adirondackalmanack.com/20...-bad-idea.html



http://www.adirondackalmanack.com/20...ilderness.html
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Old 12-23-2015, 08:01 AM   #39
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Justin,
Please refresh my memory of the NYCO deal.
Jim
Here is the Adkforum thread from a couple years ago:
NYCO Constitutional Amendment
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