It's Official: Great Adirondack Trail Run Permitted

[jeclose]

It's Official: From Sheryl Quinn, FOIL Coordinator for DEC Region 5:

"Yes, the TRP was issued and a copy will be sent to you in tomorrow's
mail."

[Tim Seaver]

It's Official: Great Adirondack Trail Run Permitted

Sweet!

Thanks for the update - I almost forgot!

I just registered ( just call 518-576-2281) - they are about 1/4 full as of today.

[kwc]

here is the link to the site about the trail run.

http://www.mountaineer.com/trail_run/index.htm

I believe that this is a different course (for the most part) than last year's run.

[Rik]

here is the link to the site about the trail run.

http://www.mountaineer.com/trail_run/index.htm

I believe that this is a different course (for the most part) than last year's run.

Course looks pretty similiar to me. Am I wrong?

[Little Rickie]

I think I'm going to sign up for the race. Pay my money and not run.

Not that I could run that trail or any other mt trail anyway.

The charity gets the money.

I'll save the enviroment from one of those terrible trail runners that would rip up the trail worse than my old lard assssss in my hiking boots would and I get to drink their free beer.

I'm undecided on whether I will buy a book or something from those heartless capitalists that organized this.

Did I mention the free beer?

Little Rickie

[Mavs00]

I'm gonna sign up too, I need an excuse to get my lazy a$$ up that trail and knock off Green for about 5 lists I'm working right now. (ADK100, NY3k, ADK3k, NE770, and US35k <-- a new one

Tim, wanna come along, even with the 1 hour diversion, you're still likely to win anyway . We could get Jim to guide us, he's knows the way

Did someone say BEER ?????

/wise a$$ sarcasm off

[Little Rickie]

Did someone say BEER ?????

What's that bottle in your hand?


/wise a$$ sarcasm off [/QUOTE]

What sarcasm?

Think about it. What a great way to prove one's point. Buy up all the applications, support the charity, don't run. Drink their beer.

Your making a statement, supporting a good cause and get a beer buzz at the same time.

Show the people that issue the permits that you put your money where your mouth is. They gotta respect you and your position then.

Little Rickie

[Willie]

What a great way to prove one's point. Buy up all the applications, support the charity, don't run. Drink their beer.

Excellent!

[Kevin]

Think about it. What a great way to prove one's point. Buy up all the applications, support the charity, don't run. Drink their beer.

Your making a statement, supporting a good cause and get a beer buzz at the same time.

That's awesome .

But then they'll have the event each year as blackmail, and will probably not even bring the beer....

[Little Rickie]

I know you're just joking but there is a hint of ill will in it. I don't think they are that bad.

Seriously I don't see how some people can justifies how strongly they speak up. I know they feel passionate but sometimes when we communicate electronically we are bolder than when we are in person. This can at times trigger stronger emotional resposens than we intended. This can be feel like fun, stimulating, invigorating and energizing but there can be too much of a good thing. It may not be the best way to have an extended discussion.

Vigorous discussion is a good thing, I support it but I sense some people feel way more strongly than others and it could trigger emotional reactions way greater than may be called for. We are only human. We should strive to draw ourselves together, find common ground and not drive ourselves apart.

We need to relax and laugh. These things will work themselves out over time.

The sponsor seems like good people and we have more in common that we do in difference. Their intentions seem honorable. They shouldn't be condemed for doing what they feel is a good thing even if I disagree.

Many, but not all, speak up agains the event. I think there is a very large silent majority that simple do want to speak up because they do not want to get involved in controversy. We don't know what they think. Being gentler souls they don't want the aggravation.

We do not know what is right and may not during our life time. Sometimes we have to sit back, relax and wait to see what unfolds.

If anyone take my attitude as too light hearted I apologise but 25, 50 100 years from now I don't think we will have these discussions. Look at the big long term picture. Time will tell.

The DEC and permit issuers do the best they can with what they know and try hard to do the right thing. They (& we) are humans biased by our emotions and motivated by what we feel is right or wrong. This is good but we need to be more tolerant and to keep an open mind.

We do need to stay ever vigilant, for the vote of approval from silence can be very wrong as well and have very bad results.

I think if we all went for a long hike for a couple of days together this wouldn't seem so intense.

It does sadden me that people that have such wonderful passions and so much in common can't be more accepting of each other. All good things take time and we need to be patent.

Just some thoughts I've had as the day winds down.

May god bless us all with peace, health, happiness and prosperity.

Our country, with all it faults, is still the best place in the world to raise a family.

Good night. Sweet dreams.

If the beer was withheld I'd be upset.

Little Rickie

[Kevin]

Rickie, that's a very spiritual approach, but when faced with potentially unspiritual circumstances... what's the cliche, when the going gets tough?...

I've been striving to live a more spiritual existence for about a decade now. Spiritual meaning in touch with myself/others, or maybe "right sized-ness" if that makes more sense. Does that mean I'm striving for perfection? Nah. That's too boring . But in that journey I'm learning that I need to take a stand for my beliefs, regardless of whether they turn out right or wrong. To take your logic to its ends I guess we mind as well just stop caring about anything because even the things we perceive as bad are all part of god's will (G.ood O.rderly D.irection of course). We know murder and lying are not good things, but hey - in 20, 50 or 100 years no one's going to care that person was murdered or those retirement funds absconded anyways, right?

Like you said, some people feel passionately about environmental topics and if they feel passionate enough about protecting this parcel of land that they would buy a ticket to prevent a runner from placing a foot on that trail then I say more power to them. I've fallen on hard times myself and can't afford to throw money at every cause, especially with the Backcountry Heritage Association startup costs looming. But I'm sure there's others with more expendable income who may see this suggestion or a protest of some form as reasonable reaction to the situation.

[Little Rickie]

[QUOTE=Kevin]Rickie, that's a very spiritual approach...

Spiritual? I'll take that. I've been called worse. Maybe it's more like an old mans musings.

Little Rickie

[kwc]

Patagonia's response to my email

From one of the primary sponsors of the event ... for your reading pleasure!


Dear Kevin,

Thanks for email and concern with the charity trail run The Mountaineer
is hosting in Keene Valley. The Mountaineer is a 31 year old outdoor
shop that is one of the most environmentally conscience and responsible
of the dealers we do business with. The event helps two grassroots local
environmental organizations: the Ausable and Bouquet River Associations
and is very healthy eco friendly spring celebration for the community in
Keene Valley and the immediate surrounding area.

True, the owners of the store indicated that they were considering not
holding the event again after being criticized by a small hand full of
people last year. They changed their minds after weighing all the
benefits of the event and the success of the event and receiving
positive input from the environmental organizations, local residents,
participants, and the sponsors. It was a great event and good for this
sleepy little mountain hamlet awaking from a long winter's slumber.

Last year's event went off with out any problems or complaints and
generated moneys for these two worthy organizations. The run takes place
on a deserted trail- there were no other hikers or campers on the trail
during the brief time the run was held last year. This makes sense
because it is off season and during the peak of the black fly season.
The event was monitored by the DEC rangers and by the sponsors. There
was no litter, no damage to the trail and the runners were staggered.
The Mountaineer went to extra efforts by radically limiting the number
of runners (on its own), providing shuttles to avoid any parking
problems, supplied porta potties, swept the trail after the run and
conducted the run in a professional and responsible manner. The run has
been used as an example of how to do an event like this on state land.

Please understand also that the location of this run starts on private
land, travels on a deserted trail on the backside of Hopkins Mountain
and ends (the last mile plus) on private land. Keene Valley is 70% state
land and just about all of it is classified "wilderness". The social,
environmental, and community benefits of this event far outweigh any
perceived impacts which we are told and believe are non existent.

Again, thank you for contacting us about your concerns. Please feel free
to respond with any additional comments you may have.

Sincerely,

Sven Shiers
Patagonia

[Tim Seaver]

Keene Valley is 70% state
land and just about all of it is classified "wilderness". The social,
environmental, and community benefits of this event far outweigh any
perceived impacts which we are told and believe are non existent.

Woods....meet Bear.


Thanks for sharing,kwc!

[Neil]

I think the main argument in favour of the GTR is that it does no visible harm to the trail, no litter gets left behind etc. Physical things. Stuff you could film and show people. "See? No erosion. No difference in the forest" Also, it's a money maker.

The concept that using a wilderness zone to stage an event erodes the wild in wilderness in an insidious manner is something no one seems to want to know about or consider. It's too abstract. It's not a money maker. It dosn't wake up the town of Keene Valley after its winter hibernation.