Private Land in a Park?

[Neil]

I'm from north of the border and my experiences with parks in Canada are quite different from what I've encountered so far in the ADK's. For example, up here, hunting and park in the same sentence is an oxymoron. Privately owned land inside of a Park is another impossibility. Can anybody enlighten me as to how a jewel like the Adirondack Park came to contain so much privately owned land, lakes and hiking trails?
Another question, this winter will it be legal for me to drop down off of Mt. Blake towards Upper Ausable Lake and then snowshoe along it and Lower Ausable Lake to the AMR road?

[Skyclimber]

Yes, make sure there is safe ice on the lake to get to the Carry Trail.

[redhawk]

If I'm not mistaken, the adirondack Park started off wth a lot more private land then it currenty has. The and in the park could not be taken by the state under Eminent Domain. As opportunity has presented itself, The state has purchased land from private parties.

And it is unique. As far as I know it is the only "arrangement" between private citizens and state agencies to maintain and preserve wilderness.

[fvrwld]

The original plan when the blue line was drawn was that all the land within it would one day be owned by the state. The state set a limit on how much they would pay would acre( I believe $4.50/acre). Soon after the Adirondacks became "en vogue" and the wealthy began buying up land. The price of acreage rose and soon exceeded what the state was willing to pay.

[lumberzac]

The private/public lands within the park is a very interesting thing that I believe is unique to only the Adirondack Park. It started with the initial drawing of the blue line, which really had little to do with forming a park for recreation. The park was originally formed to preserve the headwaters of the Hudson to protect the drinking water for New York City. It was a strong belief that the clear cutting of forests would eventually cause the water sources to dry up. Within this blue line was a patchwork of private and public lands with the original intention that all of it would be acquired by the state. All of the towns that are within the park were already established at that time. As time past and private lands came up of sale or acquired by the state through back taxes, land was added to the forest preserve until we had the park, which exists today. While the state was adding lands to the forest preserve other legislation was being past which gave the state some control over what happens on the private lands through the Adirondack Park Agency (APA). You can’t cut down a tree on private land within the blue line without APA approval. In the end we have public lands which are protected by the state constitution making them among the most protected in the country and private lands that also have some form of protection that are overseen by a governmental agency.

Hopefully that helped explain things and didn’t make things any more confusing.

[Dick]

An interesting web site is:

http://www.adirondack-park.net/

It includes, among other things, a brief history of the development of the park from a political standpoint, citing various political "battles" throughout the park's history. Once the mining industry, and especially the timber industry became strong, clear-cutting became a big issue, and as lumberzac said, water was an underlying concern. Since Colvin's work with the legislation, there appears to have been an almost constant struggle among various interest groups, politicians, and the public to amend the law, which today looks far different from the original (there is a link on the site to the current language).

Perhaps experts in the park's history will chime in with their thoughts?

[Dick]

Another question, this winter will it be legal for me to drop down off of Mt. Blake towards Upper Ausable Lake and then snowshoe along it and Lower Ausable Lake to the AMR road?

Neil, looking at the ADK High Peaks guidebook, I see no specific indication as to whether or not it is legal or illegal for non-members to snowshoe (or ski, for that matter) on the lake. I assume it is therefore not legal, given all of the camping restrictions, warnings to stay on trails, etc. within AMR property. In any case, bushwacking on their private land is prohibited. Whether the club "looks the other way" or not, I don't know. Speaking for myself, I would honor the club's rules.

[Rick]

Neil,
you should just get your US citizenship and get it over with man!!!!

[Tom McG]

this winter will it be legal for me to drop down off of Mt. Blake towards Upper Ausable Lake and then snowshoe along it and Lower Ausable Lake to the AMR road?[/QUOTE]
I have been told, by the Game Warden, that it is not premissable to cross the Lake during the winter. I have also been told by the Club's winter staff that it is OK as long as you stay on the ice and don't tresspass any further. One more note, the Carry Trail is very, very steep as it nears the Lake, so if you go that way use full boot crampons.
Tom McG

[Rik]

Last year I crossed the lake on snowshoes to get to the 'trail to the carry" which leads to the Colvin/Blake col. Many members passed us on snowmobiles without saying a word. The trail up was very steep and unconsolidated and took a lot of work to climb. If doing the reverse I would want to know for sure that the lake was frozen as you would need to climb again if it was not.

[mike1889]

The trail up was very steep and unconsolidated and took a lot of work to climb. If doing the reverse I would want to know for sure that the lake was frozen as you would need to climb again if it was not.

The trail up is certainly steep. I went up this way with just one other person and we spent 3.5 hours breaking trail in the unbroken 2-3 feet of snow. We made the col but no further as it was pushing 2:30 p.m. Another time I climbed Colvin & Blake via the trail from the Lake Road and descended the trail to the carry. We saw snowmobiles on the lake so we knew the ice was safe. You are right that you want to make sure the lake ice is safe before committing to return this way.

[Skyclimber]

Also Neil you can always ask at the gatehouse at the Club before leaving for the Carry if the ice is safe. We have done that a couple of times, ask, before. They sometimes will say, "to follow in the snowmobile tracks."

[pterrie]

Someone commenting in this thread wrote that anyone owning private land within the blue line needs permission from the Adirondack Park Agency before cutting down a tree. That's incorrect. The APA's Private Land Use and Development Plan regulates how much cutting can be done along a lake or river shore, and there are limits on clearcutting. But otherwise a private land owner can fell a tree whenever she or he wants to.

cheers,
phil

[-ecc]

The Catskill Park is also a mix of public and private lands.
ecc

[percious]

Has anyone been on Schroon lately. I was surprised this summer to see some of the houses behind the island. They are beautiful homes (summer no doubt) But the owners clearcut their property to expose the magnificent view of Schroon. I think if I was a land owner, especially someone who paid probably 1 mil just for the land, I wouldnt want anyone telling me what to do with my own back yard. However, it sucks for everyone else, because now we see homes instead of uninterrupted coastline behind the island. What do you guys think?

-percious