makes me feel almost patriotic

[Hobbitling]

read this.

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/13560128/?GT1=8211

[Kevin]

We shoot bears too.

This was posted in the general adk area. Can you please at least TRY to post threads in an area that seems remotely appropriate? Several new members (including yourself) have posted a few threads in the past week that had nothing to do with the section they were posted in. Having to move them, leaving redirect placeholders (so you know where it got moved) clutters the forum. Then later someone has to go back and remove the redirects or else it stays cluttered.

[Hobbitling]

geeez, sorry. I didnt know exactly what category this belonged in. I didnt know it was such a big hassle. I'll be more careful from now on.

Yes, we do shoot bears. But I hope we wouldnt shoot the first wild bear seen in our country in 170 years. That hope may be unfounded however. Its just nice to live in an area with some tolerance for wildlife. It hadnt attacked anyone or done anything that isnt relatively common around here. It sounds like they resorted to killing it not because of anything the bear did, but to compensate for their own bungled job of capturing it. Ever hear of tranquilizers? I wonder how the Italians feel about this? Is it an Italian citizen?

[redhawk]

geeez, sorry. I didnt know exactly what category this belonged in. I didnt know it was such a big hassle. I'll be more careful from now on.

Yes, we do shoot bears. But I hope we wouldnt shoot the first wild bear seen in our country in 170 years. That hope may be unfounded however. Its just nice to live in an area with some tolerance for wildlife. It hadnt attacked anyone or done anything that isnt relatively common around here. It sounds like they resorted to killing it not because of anything the bear did, but to compensate for their own bungled job of capturing it. Ever hear of tranquilizers? I wonder how the Italians feel about this? Is it an Italian citizen?

I don't know about that and I don't think they are any less "civiized" then we are.

On another forum that has a lot of hunters, a person from idaho boasted about killing two bear cubs "before they grew up to kill elk calves". In other words, he killed the cubs so they would not interfere with his killing.

Thats real civilized, right?

[dog]

Sounds like a nonsense . They wanted to tranquilize him , it did not go , they killed Bruno . Tranquilization at the beginning is the same procedure as killing - shooting from a rifle ? Autorities could not provide that " free hunters " with appropriate weapon , if thy could not do it them - self ?
I think there is more behind the published story . Or Germany is degenerating .

Respect to Bruno . RIP .

[Hobbitling]

Good points everyone, and thanks for checking me. I never should have made comparisons between "Us" and "them". Civilization is an individual as well as community trait. Also, bad behavior by one person or group (German bear shooters) does not justify bad behavior by someone else (bear shooters in Idaho). Much of what I am saying is tongue in cheek. I was making the point that "civilization" comes at a cost. Many people like wildlife, as long as it stays in its box (or can be used for a profit). Unfortunately much of the wilderness in Europe was altered beyond recognition centuries ago, so that box is pretty small, and they dont seem prepared to handle the consequences of reintroducing an apex predator.

[redhawk]

I was making the point that "civilization" comes at a cost.

This is a "rerun" but appropo...

"The Old Warrior"

I awoke in the forest and he was standing there,
Clad only in a breechcloth, his torso bare
Moccasins on his feet, feather in his hair.

His face was dark, sun-pigmented skin,
Face like leather, sculpted by the wind
Piercing eyes, that peered within.

I stood up in awe and then he spoke
"Walk with me and be apprized,
what life was like before we were
civilized."

So, I journeyed with him back to a time
That existed before we were "civilized".
Before electricity, before the car
When nature ruled, and we followed her Law.

We walked through forests, abundant with trees,
with pure water running from mountain fed streams,
and air so pure, it was a pleasure to breathe.
Chlorine and fluoride were chemicals not needed
Because Natures Law by the Elders was heeded.

Into the prairie unbroken by roads,
uncluttered with signs and ugly abodes.
Everywhere roamed Bison, wild and free,
Heads held high in majesty.

Wild flowers painting this breathtaking scene,
Highlighting the carpet, still pristine
I stood in wonder and realized.
The land was fine before we were civilized.

Into the mountains un-blasted and virgin
filled with pines, maples and birches.
Uncut and unsettled, more spiritual than churches.

Elk, moose, wolf, bear, beaver, and deer.
Predator and prey each taking heed,
To follow The Mothers laws,
and take only what they need.

And then we returned from that time long ago
and it suddenly hit me that "progress" was the foe.
That if we continue to take more than we need
and nature's laws we fail to heed
That sometime in the future we will realize,
That our savagery came from trying to "civilize".

As I turned to the warrior, there was a tear in his eye,
shed for the Mother who was continuing to die.
"Listen to the Mother, hear Her cry,
Be not no fast to "civilize".

I stood and watched as he faded away,
and I knew the healing had to begin today.
I pray that others will realize,
the price we pay to "civilize".

This is copywrited BTW, Please ask for permission if using it somewhere.

[Hobbitling]

More signs of the bear revolution!

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/13602322/from/RS.4/?GT1=8211

Perhaps this was a solidarity protest by another bear. it seems we humans keep causing these problems, but its always the animal who pays. What an odd week of news.