Making Campsite Furniture

[Justin]

Edit: (I probably should have worded this a little different back when I first posted this....)

I know (now) that a lot people are (really) against the act of making tables and chairs out of dead logs and branches at a campsite and then leaving their creation behind for others to use, but some of the things I've seen over the years I think are very creative.
I do admire the craftsmanship on many of the things I've come across in my travels. Such as a chair made out of nothing but spruce logs held together with twine, or a little table with 4 legs and split logs to make an almost completely flat tabletop surface, or even the pair of tongs I found once that came in very handy for turning the steak I was cooking over the fire that time.

I think as long as you use dead, downed wood, and using only small string such as twine rather than nails or screws to hold it all together, and not using anything else but nature then it's ok to build and leave such things at a well used campsite. (imo)

I'm not sure if this actually against DEC regulations or not, but I'm very interested in learning how to build such things like a little table or chair or something sometime.

Does anyone have any photos of some of the things you may have seen or built?
Or do you know of any websites or books that would give some helpful information about the subject?

Please feel free to give any thoughts on this. --- Justin

[centerfield]

I don't think people should be making furniture in the forest unless they make a cabin to go with it. Who wouldn't like to come upon a well-furnished cabin in the woods after a long day on the trail?

Seriously, though, I think LNT gets a bit viloated when people turn backcountry campsites into Ikea showrooms. And one of the reasons campfires are prohibited in the EHPZ is because of the importance to downed and dead wood to the eosystem. Finally, tabels and chairs attract bears, especially if there is porage involved.

[Lute Hawkins]

I don't find anything wrong with building onsite furniture, especially if it's something useful. The fanciest I've done is a log crib for firewood, with a cover made of bark shingles (from a down tree) to keep the wood dry. I carved holes into the shingles and secured them on the crib frame with twine.

I don't see why anyone would get bent out of shape over seeing these kind of things, but I'm sure that between the idiot vandals and spiteful purists, they get destroyed soon after anyway.

[DuctTape]

I think there is a difference between leaving a piece at say 1. a lean-to site vs 2. a marked established campsite vs 3. an unmarked off-trail site (following the regs). In the first I do not see a problem, in the second I think it would depend upon the site in question... is it more like a lean-to site or a hidden primitive site, in the third (unmarked off trail) I would have a problem with it, I do not see how one could justify it there. That's my 2 cents.

[redhawk]

Lets see.

Leave NO Trace. Get it?

[DuctTape]

Lets see.

Leave NO Trace. Get it?

I assume that absolute includes not leaving a stash of collected firewood under the lean-to then. If so, then I apologize for not returning collected but not consumed firewood back to the forest from which it came.

[Justin]

OK. For the most part, All of the things I'm talking about, I've seen at lean-to locations.(I'm sure alot of us have seen things like this) I do firmly believe in the LEAVE NO TRACE policy, and I do get it, but I think that's kind of redundant at a lean-to, givin the numerous things people find in an unoccupied lean-to. I personally wouldn't get ticked off at the fact that there's a couple camp-made chairs and a table next to the lean-to that has cans of corn, and beans, and toilet paper, and a bag of garbage, and a notebook on the shelf. I do think if you find a man made table and chairs at a non lean-to spot,(not counting picnic tables) at primative camsite, designated or not, it would be/and is out of place and I don't think people should start building things like this at campsites around the park.

I do appreciate any thoughts on this subject, and I just wanted to get some feed back on it. After all, I'm certainly not talking about bringing 2x4's and plywood and screwguns into the woods.

[stripperguy]

Mr. Farrell,
I'm with you, I appreciate a little convenience and artistry at primitive campsites. A group of us were at St. Regis Pond a few years ago, at the point opposite the lean to, and had a great u-shaped log bench to sit upon. During the very early morning, one of my group (not a usual camping partner) decided these seats would make better firewood than furniture. Needless to say, by the time the rest of us got up, we got to eat breakfast, and every meal thereafter, sitting in the mud!! Thanks, bud!
I've been to many primitive sites repeatedly over the years, and it's interesting to see the furniture evolve and degrade as time goes on. At best, the stuff only lasts a few years before succumbing the the elements.
If you study the construction plans of Shaker furniture, some of the joints can be replicated in the woods and without metal or synthetic fasteners...the same holds true for many of the traditional wood joints, but some will take quite a while with just a pocket knife.

[Lute Hawkins]

I assume that absolute includes not leaving a stash of collected firewood under the lean-to then. If so, then I apologize for not returning collected but not consumed firewood back to the forest from which it came.

LOL! Or how about all those non-biodegradable colored disks, which people deface the trees with along the trails? After all, if you don't know where you're going, then you have no business trying to get there.

[Hobbitling]

well, if there's a fire pit, you might as well have something to sit on, if only a flat hewn log or stump.

[Pumpkin QAAD]

If your want to carve some beaver stumps into a nice arm rest for my bottle of scotch you are welcome in my woods any day. A great point about degradation because if we left no trace that would mean no footprints or buried feces either. As long as your using downed wood I don't see an issue but within reason of course because we are out roughing it.

One of the lean-to's I visit has a family tent, 2 of those chairs people bring to tail gates and I even saw crab meat in a can. A log bench by the fire pit would not be out of line.

[fingerlakeshiker]

If your want to carve some beaver stumps into a nice arm rest for my bottle of scotch you are welcome in my woods any day. A great point about degradation because if we left no trace that would mean no footprints or buried feces either. As long as your using downed wood I don't see an issue but within reason of course because we are out roughing it.

One of the lean-to's I visit has a family tent, 2 of those chairs people bring to tail gates and I even saw crab meat in a can. A log bench by the fire pit would not be out of line.

You have a point, to be truly LNT would require you to stay out of thw woods.

[DRIFTER]

I find nothing wrong with a nice table at my campsite as long as it is made mostly from the woods and can be disassembled easily and burned. I usually head in, in a canoe and bring a couple of 1x6's with me to build one with, at the end of the trip I burn them and everything is as it was. I use bailing wire to secure the table top and drill holes at home in the boards to thread the wire through.The only problem I have is when I come across a campsite with old aluminum chairs or the like , that if you had at home you would throw out!! Garbage is garbage, leave it home !.....H.

[Neil]

LNT. If building a little table out of twigs is a violation of LNT then what about Lean-To's? Or did they get grandfathered in?

My opinion: it's a free world, if you want to make a nifty table or chair out of some dead sticks and string then go right ahead.

LNT. Leave no twigs.

[pico23]

The act of building a campsite in the wilds is the worst form of LNT, so is a bridge, corduroy etc.

Perhaps those who have never built trail will be interested to know how all those flat rocks that make for a nice foot path get there? Well someone, takes a hike off the trail, finds some flat looking boulders, calls for help, 3 more people come and they put a strap around it, they now RIP the rock/boulder out of the ground, drag (or occasional carry) the boulder to the trail to be dug into the ground. While dragging a swath a ground is cut into the earth, and the rock leaves a hole. So much for hiking being low impact/LNT.

My point is I don't think a chair made from dead wood is going to have a lasting impact on the ecology of a region. And anyplace that allows campfires, some lazy campers will always decide between that chair as firewood or a seat...I bet they choose it as firewood pretty often.

I haven't really made anything since scouts that was permanent (or semi permanent), but I occasionally will make a place to cook my dinner. Usually I use downed stumps or rocks. keeping the whisperlite off the ground is key.

On the flip side there is the extreme. I've been to sites where lean-to's where built. Building a structure and a table/shelf/chair are different extremes. One takes up a whole site and is a highly visible eyesore. the other serves a functional purpose, that probably isn't even initially noticed.

I consider a chair/table the equivalent of cut wood or a fire ring. Part of the site, but not an eyesore. But that is my personal comfort level with established sites.