Energy and carbon.

[Hobbitling]

You're right, NASA is frankly the least of our problems as far as misplaced budget priorities. At least as long as this "man on mars" thing never happens, or the diet coke and mentos powered space shuttle. I can't recall at the moment what our single biggest budget expense is...

Actually, all I mentioned in my original post was particle accelerators, deep space telescopes, and landing on mars. my point was that not all science is worth the money.

I will admit that NASA has done lots of good climate research (as I try to tie this back to the original topic). And some of it was even allowed to be published without interference.

I dont think what we've discussed so far is too far off topic. Climate change may be preventable If we're willing to reorganize our priorities. However, A full blown discussion of our federal budget priorities and where out tax dollars go is probably outside the scope of this forum.

[Rivet]

Defense and security 21%
Social Security 21%
Medicare, Medicaid, and SCHIP 19%
Interest of debt 9%
Safety net programs 9%
Everything else 21%

[chairrock]

And all of that money spent on NASA and others is not just made invisible, it is ultimately spent on JOBS.All the way from the surveyor.miner,smelter, machinist,designer,truck driver,mission control ,astonauts,and and and and.....

[Hobbitling]

This money would still provide jobs if spent on other things.

Imagine the jobs that would be created if we launched an enormous clean energy campaign. Think of the market for those kinds of products. Every building in the country would need contractors to retrofit them with energy saving technology. we'd have factories churning out solar panels and wind turbines and hydrogen fuel cells and energy efficient appliances. Think of the research and development jobs. Think of all the engineers it would employ.

Think of it as a Manhattan project focused on clean energy. The best minds in the country focused on find ways to free ourselves from petroleum. Plus a massive industrial and commercial infrastructure to make it happen. you're telling me that wouldnt provide jobs?

[chairrock]

Not at all Hobbitling, just making a point that they all do.If you reread my post you will see what I say in the first sentence.(And all of that money spent on NASA and others ) with others being the key word.

[Kevin]

Neil,if you don't want anyone talking politics then why bring up subjects with politics intertwined in them?

I'm going to need to agree here...

Let's talk about the weather. Looks like rain this weekend.

[MattC]

This money would still provide jobs if spent on other things.

Imagine the jobs that would be created if we launched an enormous clean energy campaign. Think of the market for those kinds of products. Every building in the country would need contractors to retrofit them with energy saving technology. we'd have factories churning out solar panels and wind turbines and hydrogen fuel cells and energy efficient appliances. Think of the research and development jobs. Think of all the engineers it would employ.

Think of it as a Manhattan project focused on clean energy. The best minds in the country focused on find ways to free ourselves from petroleum. Plus a massive industrial and commercial infrastructure to make it happen. you're telling me that wouldnt provide jobs?

http://www.apolloalliance.org/

Matt

[Hobbitling]

I figured there had to be something out there like this, if only in the "wishful thinking" phase

I'll have to check it out in more detail

Thanks.

[redhawk]

Actually we need the Space Exploration.

we are running out of SPACE. Space to recreate, space to live, space in general.

Only the worlds number 1 villain (presently, but subject to change depending on convenience) China has seen the necessity of limiting population growth. Unless the rest of the "Developed Nations" (Just another way of saying "we're better then them to rationalize policies).

So unless something is done, there will not be enough SPACE for everyone, and no resources. So we need to find SPACE to colonize so we can screw that up too. And you can bet that the mining and mineral rights are already divvied up. Or maybe nations will go to war over those rights, and we'll have huge losses of human life which will be good for the planet.

As far as the money goes, how much is going into the pockets of contractors who are in favor with whichever administration is in power at the time?

[sully1763]

Speaking of breaking from foreign oil, has any one seen the web sites about "Water car" basically using water as a fuel. I originally heard this idea a year ago when I worked at Home Depot, a customer came in to buy the components to convert his car to run on "water". Never heard the results.

There seems to be a lot of info online about this with some interesting twists, murder, 100's of patents shelved by big oil...I think the creators of these sites are trying to insinuate that the Gov't would suppress this info...

[Hobbitling]

yeah, the guy who invented this "water powered car" was a scam artist. he got sued, and the system was proven to be a hoax.

there are systems that use electricity from the alternater to generate hydrogen, which is then injected into the fuel/air mix through a modified supercharger. But it aint cheap.

[chairrock]

British Tire Recycling- saw this and thought some might be interested..

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/.../mftyre126.xml

[redhawk]

yeah, the guy who invented this "water powered car" was a scam artist. he got sued, and the system was proven to be a hoax.

there are systems that use electricity from the alternater to generate hydrogen, which is then injected into the fuel/air mix through a modified supercharger. But it aint cheap.

Actually the Hydrogen car is a reality. Problem is that at present you need to convert the water into hydrogen yourself. Not all that expensive or difficult to make the converter. however, I don't know what the car costs. I understand it has decent range. if there were fueling staions, then it would be a viable choice.

I suspect however that there are major forces working against it's adoption.

[rollinslover64]

Actually we need the Space Exploration.

we are running out of SPACE. Space to recreate, space to live, space in general.

Only the worlds number 1 villain (presently, but subject to change depending on convenience) China has seen the necessity of limiting population growth. Unless the rest of the "Developed Nations" (Just another way of saying "we're better then them to rationalize policies).

So unless something is done, there will not be enough SPACE for everyone, and no resources. So we need to find SPACE to colonize so we can screw that up too. And you can bet that the mining and mineral rights are already divvied up. Or maybe nations will go to war over those rights, and we'll have huge losses of human life which will be good for the planet.

As far as the money goes, how much is going into the pockets of contractors who are in favor with whichever administration is in power at the time?

Actually as far as space goes the entire worlds population occupies about 1,350 sq miles which equates to an area about the size of 1/7th of the adirondacks.Sometimes it seems like they're all there though.

[randomscooter]

Actually as far as space goes the entire worlds population occupies about 1,350 sq miles which equates to an area about the size of 1/7th of the adirondacks.Sometimes it seems like they're all there though.

At 5.64 square feet per person I'm not sure where I'll put my jacuzzi.

I just hope I have good neighbors.