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Old 03-24-2017, 11:15 PM   #21
JohnnyVirgil
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I've been using the Ursack for over 12 years. I bought one for my first trip to the Winds and have been using the same one ever since. Bears out West aren't the friendly little black bears we have here in The Park. Used with the odor retarding Opsack it's more easily packed and much easier to store/hang than a canister. I would suggest that they are also more likely to be used.

The Ursack is a proven food storage product.
I am hopeful that they will gain endorsement here but I won't hold my breath waiting. I won't use a canister.
I've never used one but -- wouldn't a bear just carry that away? And failing that, wouldn't all your food inside get smushed by all the frustrated chewing? Not to mention all the bear saliva.
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Old 03-25-2017, 09:42 AM   #22
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I've never used one but -- wouldn't a bear just carry that away? And failing that, wouldn't all your food inside get smushed by all the frustrated chewing? Not to mention all the bear saliva.
The idea of the sack is that it can be mangled. It's kevlar. Yes, I suppose your vittles could get pretty mashed up in there if a bear decides to have sport with it. As far as carrying it away, ideally that won't happen if you properly secure it. Above tree line there are no places to hang them so you typically would tie them to a rock but necessarily get them far from your tent....
I've not had issues with it even though there were fresh bear scat and tracks withing a very short distance from my tent....

The canister is probably a superior storage product but it's not an adequate backpacking solution. There's no way a canister can facilitate a week long hike above treeline...it's an impediment...bear encounters typically happen as you get back into the trees and on trails...hm.. sounds like The Park. For Marcy Dam you might want to bring the can.
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Old 03-25-2017, 11:31 AM   #23
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According to NYS DEC, hard-sided bear canisters are mandatory in the Eastern High Peaks Wilderness Area (EHPWA) and recommended in the balance of the park. The Ursack, even with the optional aluminum liner, doesn't qualify as a hard-sided bear canister so it is not acceptable for use in the EHPWA.

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...Above tree line there are no places to hang them so you typically would tie them to a rock but necessarily get them far from your tent....
That's a completely hypothetical situation for the Adirondacks because you're not permitted to camp above tree line.

For most of the park, the primitive-camping elevation limit is 4000 feet and reduced to 3500 (**) for the EHPWA. New York's treeless alpine zones lie in the EHPWA at elevations greater than 4000 feet.

If we're on the subject of treeless, long-haul routes, even the John Muir Trail requires hikers to use approved bear canisters. Here's the list for Yosemite (all hard-sided): https://www.nps.gov/yose/planyourvisit/containers.htm


(**) There are only two, designated campsites higher than 3500 feet (Sno-bird and Lake Marie-Louise) and both lie below tree line.
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Old 03-25-2017, 01:37 PM   #24
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According to NYS DEC, hard-sided bear canisters are mandatory in the Eastern High Peaks Wilderness Area (EHPWA) and recommended in the balance of the park. The Ursack, even with the optional aluminum liner, doesn't qualify as a hard-sided bear canister so it is not acceptable for use in the EHPWA.


That's a completely hypothetical situation for the Adirondacks because you're not permitted to camp above tree line.
As previously noted, my purpose for purchasing the Ursack was for use in the Winds (Wind River Range). I stated a preference for it over the canister but did not suggest that it is "legal" to use in The Park. I don't camp anywhere that a can is mandated....
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Old 03-25-2017, 02:39 PM   #25
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@mgc

Understood. I wanted to clarify the conversation seeing that this forum is largely dedicated to discussing all things Adirondack.

So "For Marcy Dam you might want to bring the can." is more like "For Marcy Dam you must bring the can." because it lies in the EHPWA.

Decades of ineffective bear-hang practices at heavily-frequented Marcy Dam effectively made it a pantry for bears. They learned how to defeat all sorts of marginal suspension techniques and even some good ones. Mandating bear canisters attempts to break the bear's connection between "hiker" and "easy pickings".

Of course, now the clever bears show up at dinner time to raid the cookpot and any canisters that were mistakenly left open.
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Old 03-26-2017, 05:22 PM   #26
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@mgc

So "For Marcy Dam you might want to bring the can." is more like "For Marcy Dam you must bring the can." because it lies in the EHPWA.

Decades of ineffective bear-hang practices at heavily-frequented Marcy Dam effectively made it a pantry for bears.
Yes... sorry..I was wishy washy about that. Good catch.

WRT Marcy Dam....for me it's day hikes in those areas now. I was able to enjoy what are now heavily hammered areas back in the 60's and 70's before there were large crowds and bear problems. Back before the earth cooled you could roll in at the dam at dark and have your pick of lean-to's and not worry about anything bigger than mice.
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Old 03-29-2017, 03:09 PM   #27
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The Backpackers’ Cache

$8 per 2 nights

Garcia (manufacturer's site) is down for maintenance.
Funny, the "should be back up soon" page has been there since at least Jan 2013.

Here is what their site looked like in Nov 2012.
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