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Old 11-26-2018, 03:17 PM   #81
montcalm
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Even if was state land, it's Tug Hill. The state forests don't have the same regulations as the Forest Preserve does.
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Old 11-26-2018, 03:39 PM   #82
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Even if was state land, it's Tug Hill. The state forests don't have the same regulations as the Forest Preserve does.
I don't know, it seems pretty clear to me.

Please explain how the following regulation does not apply to state land on Tug Hill or if land on Tug Hill as being any different than any other part of the state and state lands:

Part 190 Use of State Lands6 CRR-NY 190.8
6 CRR-NY 190.8
190.8 General

(g) No person shall deface, remove, destroy or otherwise injure in any manner whatsoever any tree, flower, shrub, fern, fungi or other plant like organisms, moss or other plant, rock, soil, fossil or mineral or object of archaeological or paleontological interest found or growing on State land, except for personal consumption or under permit from the Commissioner of Environmental Conservation and the Commissioner of Education, pursuant to section 233 of the Education Law.
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Old 11-26-2018, 04:16 PM   #83
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We planned on a lean to shelter at first but coming upon a downed maple with adequate branches to form a structure i felt it a good opportunity to practice making this type of shelter rather than doing it for the first time in a real survival situation. We did harvest low evergreen branches from several trees which we tried to do as ethically as possible by spreading out over numerous trees over a large area. I spend a lot of time in the woods practicing low impact camping and try to be as efficient as possible. This isn't a regular practice to harvest live branches but saw a good opportunity to do it. I do respect and understand the concerns stated. No live trees were downed during our outing.
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Old 11-26-2018, 04:28 PM   #84
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Did you have or seek to have a permit? Did you check first with a DEC ranger or Encon officer? You must know that there is a large DEC office just outside the village of Lowville.
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Old 11-26-2018, 05:04 PM   #85
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My point for the original post was simply to point out and perhaps introduce someone to a different shelter choice. Did I violate a regulation? Yes. But by letter of the law, stepping off the trail and onto vegetation appears to be a violation also which is a bit over the top with exception of alpine vegetation. However, many people on this forum often complain that many who enjoy the outdoor spaces throughout the state aren't properly prepared. How do you be prepared? Practice. Which was my goal in my latest outing. If my practicing of survival skills in as a responsible way as possible is still railed upon, if the fact I better prepare myself for self rescue and endure the elements without putting rangers or volunteers in danger or consuming tax payer dollars is still not acceptable I am at a loss on how to satisfy all the needs. Finally, if true survival dictates I must chop down a tree on state land I will not be concerned about violating a regulation. Especially considering the amount of trash I carry out from the various camping locations in my region.
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Old 11-26-2018, 05:36 PM   #86
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How do you be prepared? Practice.
I'll ask the question again, did you check with the DEC office in Lowville for legal, ethical, and responsible methods and locations for preparation and practice? Citing stepping off trail as a violation is just silly.

A simple google search will turn up dozens of sources. Try "survival training near me". To name a few:

HTTPS://WWW.ADK.ORG/DISCOVER/SKILLS-WORKSHOPS/
WINTER SURVIVAL 101JANUARY 12-13
Learn essential winter survival skills including: backcountry preparedness, snowshoeing basics, shelter-building, avalanche awareness, fire-building, and water procurement. We’ll also cover cold weather injuries and illnesses, Leave No Trace backcountry skills & ethics for winter and more. Overnight accommodations will be provided in a heated yurt at the Heart Lake Program Center.

HTTP://WWW.NORTHCAMPSURVIVAL.COM/COURSES/

LEARN OUTDOOR SURVIVAL SKILLS
Our school and wilderness training will help prepare you to endure adversity in both the urban and backcountry environments.
http://mtnscoutsurvival.com/survival...og.php?class=1

https://earthworkprograms.com/adult-programs/
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Old 11-26-2018, 08:47 PM   #87
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Basically you just want me to admit I'm wrong right? Yeah, my actions were wrong according to nys laws. In my opinion the laws of mother nature rule supreme and they rule without prejudice. I respect her deeply and smartly enough to be prepared when she brings judgement. I will do my best to weather her storm if directed my way. Because just as she can reign with a cold iron fist she can teach and provide like only she can. So if I could turn back the clocks and change the actions of my trip, would I? Not in the slightest. Whether or not I post about it on here again? I'll let the crowd decide...
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Old 11-26-2018, 09:25 PM   #88
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Your last post clearly indicates have no regard for NYS law or the DEC, or the purpose for regulation and ethical outdoor guidelines that protect and preserve the environment for all to enjoy. I wonder if you have ever had a positive communication with any officer of the DEC? You might also consider rereading Forum Rule #8 (you did that when you first joined the forum, right?)
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Old 11-26-2018, 09:32 PM   #89
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So if I could turn back the clocks and change the actions of my trip, would I? Not in the slightest. Whether or not I post about it on here again? I'll let the crowd decide...
I wouldn't have done it (off of my own land) but even if I had, I wouldn't have posted about it, but that's just me. It encourages that sort of thing, and the next guy (that you don't have any control over) might not source his materials so ethically.
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Old 11-26-2018, 10:56 PM   #90
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I wouldn't have done it (off of my own land) but even if I had, I wouldn't have posted about it, but that's just me. It encourages that sort of thing, and the next guy (that you don't have any control over) might not source his materials so ethically.
You raise a valid point, Thank you.
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Old 11-26-2018, 11:08 PM   #91
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Your last post clearly indicates have no regard for NYS law or the DEC, or the purpose for regulation and ethical outdoor guidelines that protect and preserve the environment for all to enjoy. I wonder if you have ever had a positive communication with any officer of the DEC? You might also consider rereading Forum Rule #8 (you did that when you first joined the forum, right?)
I respect the fact that you take all this so seriously, truly. I actually think we would agree on many things in regards to preserving the environment and respecting it, regardless of the discussed topic above. Therefore out of respect for the forum rules and in an effort to prevent others from violating rule #8, I will remove my original post. And to answer your last question I actually maintain a very a good rapport with the dec representatives in the area and doubtful as though it may seem by my post I obey the regulations they set.

Safe travels and adventures to you all.
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Old 11-27-2018, 05:58 AM   #92
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Thank you, I appreciate that very much. I work closely in various projects and programs with my friends at the DEC all over the state. My parents grew up on Tug Hill and I have spent much time in the back woods there. Iit holds a special place in my life and I do have a protective feeling for the area.
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Old 11-27-2018, 11:16 AM   #93
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JIRWIN85
If it is a true survival situation that is one thing. Whatever is necessary to survive a night in the forest is understandable. IMHO training can be done on private property with permission or on your own property. Not to add fuel to this discussion, because you sound like a respecter of our natural resources. Thank you for cleaning up after thoughtless bottom feeders. There are many lurkers here who are quick to take advantage of situations. Welcome to the Forum.
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Old 11-27-2018, 01:46 PM   #94
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jirwin85 - I've read your posts and understand where you're coming from but will ask only this...Why don't you carry a decent sized nylon tarp (10'x12') when traveling? One thing I learned long ago in emergency situations is to save my energy. It's infinitely easier to put up a tarp then it is to have to cut down boughs, etc.; especially in heavy snow conditions. To me, that's all part of "being prepared" when I travel in the back country.

That's all for now. Take care and until next time...be well.

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Old 11-28-2018, 08:52 PM   #95
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jirwin85 - I've read your posts and understand where you're coming from but will ask only this...Why don't you carry a decent sized nylon tarp (10'x12') when traveling? One thing I learned long ago in emergency situations is to save my energy. It's infinitely easier to put up a tarp then it is to have to cut down boughs, etc.; especially in heavy snow conditions. To me, that's all part of "being prepared" when I travel in the back country.

That's all for now. Take care and until next time...be well.

snapper
Rest assured I did carry a tarp plus my rain fly from my hammock. Used the tarp on the ground in the shelter and the rain fly to sure up the windward side of the structure and reduce the amount of natural cover I needed to use.
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Old 11-29-2018, 05:18 PM   #96
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With the freezing rain forecasted for Saturday night into Sunday morning maybe you should’ve waited to practice your bushcraft survival skills until this weekend.
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Old 12-02-2018, 12:16 PM   #97
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Moose Mountain Pond 12/1/18
Miraculously survived the night without cutting any live trees or bracnches...



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Old 12-02-2018, 12:40 PM   #98
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Don't look now but I think your snowshoes just went up in flames!
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Old 12-02-2018, 01:29 PM   #99
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Don't look now but I think your snowshoes just went up in flames!
Haha...the ghost of Christmas Snowshoe.
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Old 12-02-2018, 02:22 PM   #100
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Did you sled in, or pack it on your back?
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