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Old 11-19-2003, 09:41 PM   #1
funkyfreddy
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Mountain Lions in the ADK?

Has anyone seen or heard of any? Please post and tell us whether or not you believe there is a population of them in NY state or in the Northeast. Thanks, Fred
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Old 11-20-2003, 12:51 AM   #2
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Hey Fred I am glad to see you found your way over here! I totally believe there is a population although I cannot prove it. I also believe there are wolves too so who knows maybe we will run into a pack of wolves or a stray lion.
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Old 11-20-2003, 09:49 AM   #3
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I know for a fact there are wolves (have heard them this past summer from a mile or so away).

Mtn Lions? If there are, they hide/avoid people well.

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Old 11-20-2003, 10:24 AM   #4
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Wolves, Bears and Mt. Lions are among the most elusive creatures on this continent. So while it may be possible to know Wolves may be in an area by hearing them Mt. Lions may be in an area and not know they are around as long as they have a stable food supply. Bears are more noticeable due to their size and the evidence they leave behind is more noticeable (tracks and scat). It is generally when their food supply is disrupted or declining that they become both agressive and less elusive. I know I read that central PA. and N.Y have the largest populations east of Big Muddy. I will see if I can find an online link to the printed info I read. The info I read suggested that the numbers are not large but stable. The read said that N.C. was the 3rd highest population in the east.


Kevin,

Are you certain they were Wolves and not Coyotes? Wolves generall bark and howl as individuals and usually only sound off as a group in areas with relatively high concentrations. Coyotes do a lot of yipping and squealing that Wolves don't ever do. When there are only one or 2 Coyotes sounding off it can be confusing if you haven't herd both in the wild often. Wolves will definitly put a chill in your bones when you hear them as their howls are so penetrating. Living in Alaska I have heard both a lot.
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Old 11-20-2003, 03:51 PM   #5
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I choose to believe catamounts have returned to the northeast.
While driving Rt9 heading east in VT my wife and I spotted something off the side of the road near the tree line. It was dusk and it was drizzling. I slammed the car into reverse and backed up a hill (stupid but, we needed to know what we had seen). We watched as what we are now both sure was a big cat went back into the trees.
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Old 11-20-2003, 04:08 PM   #6
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Unsure if it was coyote, and I wouldn't know the difference. Next time I hear it, I'll ask one of the more experienced hikers I'm with what they think it is.
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Old 11-20-2003, 04:16 PM   #7
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big cats - yes

Allegheny State Park has a substantial number of big cats so I can only guess that the Adirondacks would have 'em.

It would be great if Wolves were still in the 'Dacks. I'm not doubting that they are. I would think that the sheer size of the park would make it impossible for them not to be.
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Old 11-23-2003, 11:17 PM   #8
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I would have to fathom a guess that Kevin most likely heard a coyote, although a few years ago I heard they were thinking about reintroducing wolves back into the Adirondack Mtns.

As for mountain lions I would be skeptical, however bobcats are the more likely cat to be out there.
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Old 11-28-2003, 10:35 AM   #9
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Cougars in the DAKS

There are almost certainly some cougars in the DAKS, They remain elusive, but are regularly sighted a few times each year.

Check out this SITE .

It seems that there have been several "probable" sightings which are less then "conclusive evidence", but are very credible (like from DEC officials).

Like the small (<75), but stable confirmed Moose population, they are regularly seen, but true conclusive evidence eludes us. Read about the "kill site" near Keene Valley in 1993, (IMHO) it is the best evidence so far.

I think the debate rages as to whether the cougars present are "native populations" or released "pets". No doupt, if they exsist in NY, it is in very small numbers. There are "Confirmed" cougars in other NE states.

From what I understand, the suspected wolves in the DAKS are more likely Coyote/Dog hybrids (known under the misnomer Eastern Wolf) and are not true Timber or Grey Wolves. The plan to introduce Grey Wolves into the DAKS was shot down several years ago.
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Old 11-28-2003, 09:25 PM   #10
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Thanks for the map link!

Hi Tim, Thanks a lot! That's just what I was looking for. It's quite interesting reading all of those stories and eyewitness accounts. Makes me want to spend more time exploring the Adirondacks. If anyone hears any more tales about cougars in the NE please post. Thanks, Fred
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Old 11-29-2003, 08:14 PM   #11
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While driving to whiteface in 2001, during a late season blizzard, there was about three feet of fresh snow in the woods. My friend bing and I we're noticing lots of deer in the road, probably because it was easier for them to walk. I was concentrating on driving. He screamed mountain lion. He swears that he saw one. I did not see it. There were lots of deer on the road, and maybe it was looking for an easy prey item. He's a pretty straight shooter type of guy, so I believe that he saw a big cat. If he would of said bigfoot, I might have turned around for a better look...
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Old 12-31-2003, 02:34 PM   #12
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Adk mtn lions

I can tell you from first hand experience that there are mountain lions in the Dacks. I have been hiking for over 30 yrs in a certain unnamed wilderness area. It was in January in the late 70's or early 80's at 3:00 AM. I was driving my van and everyone else was sleeping as we entered the area on the way to the State Park, to the point where the snow plow stopped plowing. A large cat, at least as large as a german shepard, bounded across the road, illuminated by my headlights. The tail looked as long as the body.
I was the only one that saw it that night. We parked the van and put on our packs and snowshoes for the 5 mile hike to a lean to.
The following day we hiked to a frozen waterfall, and on that hike we found large cat tracks with tail swipes in between them in the snow. I have spoken to several local people who have also had experiences. There are definitely at least a few cougers in the Dacks, and I for one am glad to share the forest with them.

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Old 01-12-2004, 03:36 PM   #13
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I live in Wells, NY, located between Northville and Speculator. Last year there was a cougar (Puma, Mountain Lion, etc) at the end of my driveway just outside some woods. I got a good look at at through field glasses but by the time I grabbed my camera and got the telephoto lens on it, it was gone. I was able to follow tracks for about a quarter of a mile but then lost the trail.

We have also seen a wolf walking across the ice on Lake Algonquin from our kitchen window.

I spend a lot of time in the Silver Lake and Siamese Ponds Wilderness and have not observed either there although I know they are there.

Two Cougars were observed in Mayfield, near the shore of Great Sacandaga Lake in the Cranberry Creek section. I did not see the cats but when asked was able to verify that the tracks were definately Cougar.

I have observed Lynx in the Adks on several occasions.
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Old 01-19-2004, 02:07 AM   #14
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Interesting. While camping at silver lake this fall there was a pack of what I assumed to be wild dogs that sounded off through out the night. I'm alittle bit curious now if they might have been these eastern wolves. Either way it was pretty cool.
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Old 01-19-2004, 10:09 AM   #15
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1/18/04
Mountain lions back in the news
By DENNIS APRILL, Outdoors Columnist

It’s a topic that will not go away. I thought my last mention of mountain lions would be during the year-end wrap-up a month ago. Then recently there was an attack and mauling of a California woman by a mountain lion. This was followed by new important information from the Eastern Cougar Network (easterncougarnet.org). According to that organization, which compiles data from throughout the country, cougars, also called mountain lions, were confirmed in Nebraska, two were shot last fall in Iowa, and two have been confirmed in Minnesota by that state’s Department of Natural Resources.

Clearly, mountain lions are expanding their range in the West, but these are national stories with no local connections, that is until 10 days ago.

On Jan. 8, Ted Premo and his wife Kristine were driving west on the Military Turnpike. A little over a mile east of Ellenburg Corners and Northern Adirondack Central School, the Premos saw a mountain lion cross the highway in front of their car, stop in the woods on the other side and look back before taking off. "It had a long tail and weighed about a hundred pounds," Premo says. "I’m sure it couldn’t be anything but a mountain lion."

Ted Premo is an experienced hunter and trapper; one of his bobcat trophies, now mounted, sits on the wall above the counter in the hunting section of Dick’s Sporting Goods in Plattsburgh where he works, so his sighting can’t be brushed aside.

I don’t want to rehash much of what I’ve written on the topic of mountain lions in the North Country. A lot of that can be found on the website www.pressrepublican.com/outdoors. I’d rather focus on a couple key points for those in the future who think they see a mountain lion. I’ll start with a story.

Last Monday, on my way to Fernow Forest for a hike, a dark cat-like animal crossed in front of my car on a back road before Silver Lake. Though there was no house nearby, my first thought was a house cat. I made that inference based on the size of the animal and other characteristics like a long tail.

I stopped where the animal had crossed and looked to see if it, like some animals will, stopped and looked back. It didn’t. Then I began to try and fine tune my observation. Could it have been a fisher? Yes, size wise, but this animal lacked the fisher’s build. I finally got out of the car and checked the tracks; they were clearly those of a house cat.

I believe we all operate this way to some extent, though I am no expert and have no psychological training beyond Psychology 101, which I took eons ago in college. When an unknown animal appears out of the clear blue, we make quick judgments: Was it the size of a house cat, or a golden retriever? Or, if it’s a bird, is it crow size? Blue jay size? Then we notice the color and maybe we pick up on a characteristic or two depending on the length of the sighting: Is there a long tail? What is the dominant color? Does the lighting affect the color? Is it walking, running or loping? All of this and much more is formulated into a conclusion about what we saw, but how accurate is this?

I remember the old professor’s trick in Psychology 101 when he had a student come in from the hallway, steal an eraser, then run out. We were then asked to describe the thief. There were 20 students in the class, and there were 20 different descriptions.

Getting back to Ted Premo and what makes his sighting plausible is that he went back and got corroborating proof: he photographed the animal’s tracks, which were 3 ½ inches across, certainly bigger than those of any bobcat or domestic cat.

If this is indeed a cougar, I am still no closer to answering two key questions than I was 20 years ago. They are: where did the mountain lion come from (there is almost zero likelihood a remnant population exists here from the 19th Century), and what happens to animals such as this one, where does it go?

If I got those answers, I will solve one of the most intriguing North Country wildlife mysteries of all time.
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Old 01-19-2004, 01:02 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally posted by adk-46r
1/18/04
Mountain lions back in the news
By DENNIS APRILL, Outdoors Columnist

If this is indeed a cougar, I am still no closer to answering two key questions than I was 20 years ago. They are: where did the mountain lion come from (there is almost zero likelihood a remnant population exists here from the 19th Century), and what happens to animals such as this one, where does it go?

If I got those answers, I will solve one of the most intriguing North Country wildlife mysteries of all time.
Mother Nature is fickle, she just does what needs to be done and does not need to "improve" on it, like we humans.. There is no logic and in general Nature and animals are much smarter then we humans. They do what has to be done to adapt to survive. There is no science, no intellect, just instinct, simpliciry and necessity.

For myself, The cat I saw here in Wells were just that, Cougar. Having tracked and tagged some cats years ago, I know what they look like and what their tracks look like.

Whether it's "logical" to humans or not, there are Cougar in the Adirondacks, Wolves too. How they got here, why they are here, I don't presume to know. It's not necessary that I know the how or why, only that they are!
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Old 01-22-2004, 12:59 AM   #17
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Until I see a mountain lion on my mantle, I don't believe there are any in the Adirondacks. It was probably a jackalope in a costume playing a practical joke on gullible people.Hop Hop Hop
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Old 01-22-2004, 09:03 AM   #18
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Until I see a mountain lion on my mantle...
Don't you need to carry a gun first?

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Old 01-22-2004, 10:36 AM   #19
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Until I see a mountain lion on my mantle
Most mantles aren't wide enough for a mountain lion to perch on!
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Old 01-22-2004, 11:32 AM   #20
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Most mantles aren't wide enough for a mountain lion to perch on!
Niiiice kitty, niiiiiice kitty...
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